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Manchester United vs. Chicago Fire - World Football Challenge #1: Three Questions

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With Manchester United coming to town tomorrow, Saturday, July 23, at 4:00 PM CST to take on the Chicago Fire at Soldier Field, we exchange three questions with Gene Um of The Busby Babe.  If you aren't headed to Soldier Field, you can catch the game on ESPN2 or ESPN Deportes.  Gene's answer to my first question is below and the other five questions in the exchange are after the break.

Hot Time In Old Town asks The Busby Babe

1. FIFA is implementing a set of Financial Fair Play Rules (FFP) soon. Are you concerned with how these new rules will impact Manchester United and their ability to challenge for a Premier League title year after year? Do you see Manchester United being able to comply with these rules or face sanctions from FIFA if they cannot comply?

To be quite honest, I'm not completely privy to the details of the FFP rules. Part of this stems from the uncertainty on how the rules will be applied. For example, does Manchester City's new mega sponsorship deal with Etihad Airways make a mockery of the intent? By the strictest of interpretations, about half of the clubs in Europe would fail to comply at the current moment - including clubs like United, FC Barcelona, and Chelsea.

I suspect the bigger clubs will be in close coordination with the governing bodies that will police FFP. United also has the complicated issue of an unpopular owners that bought the club in 2005 in a leveraged buy out that put massive debt on the club. Despite having enormous operating profits, the club is hindered in their finances by this debt - and perhaps this puts them into jeopardy for FFP. I'm not sure if anyone quite knows the exact details - at least those not on the inside of things.

Because of United's ambition, I would guess they will be okay and will sort it all out - as will most of the clubs. Perhaps naively, but I'm not too worried. I suppose it wouldn't be shocking if a big profile club fails to comply - this certainly would send a message.

Star-divide

2. Keeping with the theme of FFP, one thing that is not counted against a club is investing in youth development/academy systems. How would you rate Manchester United's youth development academy right now on a scale of 1 to 10? How do you think FFP will affect Manchester United's youth academy approach heading into the future?

It is actually quite an exciting time for the United youth as the club just won their 10th FA Youth Cup in the Spring. Although anticipating which youth players will go on to have successful careers is a bit of guesswork, the likes of Paul Pogba, Ryan Tunnicliffe, Will Keane, and Ravel Morrison have the United faithful excited. Morrison in particular, is being touted as the most exciting prospect since the famous 1992 FA Youth Cup winning side of Ryan Giggs, David Beckham, Nicky Butt, Gary Neville, Phil Neville, and Paul Scholes. However, Morrison already has shown a propensity for legal trouble at age 18 and it is a threat to derail a promising career.

The club has quite a history of developing youth into the senior side and in fact, the namesake of our blog is a tribute to a group of young players that Sir Matt Busby developed in the 1950s - 8 of the players actually died in the 1958 Munich Air Disaster. Because of the club's history in developing youth and with the promising group of current youngsters, I would rate the youth development at about an 8 right now - it would be a 9 if Morrison didn't have his legal issues. Coinciding with the impending FFP, it will most certainly continue to be a priority for the club.

3. It always exciting for Manchester United to come to the US for exhibitions. However it seems like Americans are the one doing all the watching. Does Manchester United scout MLS currently? Do you see them starting to target MLS or even North America in the future or will they continue to focus on European talent for the forseeable future?

While United will continue to scout the globe, the majority of their players will continue to come from Europe and possibly Brazil in the near future. It's been speculated that United have developed some sort of relationship with Dutch side FC Twente in developing Brazilian talent. While not the MLS, the club's signing last year of Javier 'Chicharito' Hernandez from Mexico shows their willingness to find talent in any league and on any continent. United's purchase of Tim Howard in 2003 from the then New York MetroStars shows their willingness to scout and sign players from the MLS if they see the player a fit.

The MLS' growth has been organic and judging by the success of Real Salt Lake in the CONCACAF Champions League, it also appears tangible. As long as this trend continues, I would guess that more MLS players will find their way to England and thus United as well.

The Busby Babe asks Hot Time In Old Town


1. What is the anticipation like in Chicago for Manchester United's visit? In the past, crowds have tended to be pro-United during most of their visits, including the one in New England last week. However, I personally attended the match in Seattle on Wednesday and the crowd was decidedly pro-Sounders. Many hardcore SSFC supporters seemed to have mixed feelings over the friendly as it coincided with a congested fixture list. Will Chicago be like either of these visits or perhaps a mix?

The anticipation is pretty impressive. It's tough for the Fire to get a lot of media coverage in Chicago because while most major cities have no more than 4 other major sports teams (NFL,MLB, NBA, NHL), Chicago has two baseball teams with large fan bases to compete against in the summer time. They also face an ‘established' issue because the Bears (NFL), Blackhawks (NHL), Cubs (MLB) and White Sox (MLB) were all founded prior to 1927. The Cubs were founded in 1870 so not only were they founded before the Chicago Fire Soccer Club, they were founded a year before the Great Chicago Fire itself. Just as Manchester United has generations of fans from across the world, fandom for other Chicago teams has been passed down as a birthright. The Chicago Bulls may have only been founded in 1966 but Michael Jordan captured the world's attention and the Bulls current best player, Derrick Rose, is a hometown hero. The Fire have a large population to reach out to for fans but sports only get 5 minutes on the 10:00 PM news whether you are in Portland, Maine or San Diego, California.

The Chicago media is amped up for this matchup as evidenced by yesterday's joint press conference receiving coverage far and wide. Fire players have been making a lot of appearances on tv and radio shows this week. Soldier Field is expecting over 60,000 for tomorrow's game. The name and identity of Manchester United play well in Chicago.

In terms of the crowd for Saturday, I think it will be a mixed atmosphere. The ticket was included in the Chicago Fire season ticket package so there will be several thousand Fire supporters not to mention the friends and family they bring along for the game. Soldier Field is more of an attractive venue for certain people and it's more accessible via public transportation than the Fire's home of Toyota Park. Chicago is a very international city so I expect Manchester United to be well represented. If I have to make a guess, I'd say 33% for Manchester United, 33% Chicago Fire, 33% there for the spectacle and 1% VIPs, media, etc.

In terms of the game itself, even the most diehard Fire fan doesn't have too much room to complain about the placement of this game on the schedule. Chicago doesn't have a MLS regular season game until August 3rd and the team could use more attention in the Windy City. It's an uphill battle competing for fan support against other historic Chicago sporting franchises. This game makes the team money, the players like the opportunity to play against Manchester United and their world-class talent, and it gets that all important exposure too.

2. Who are some Fire players that United should be most aware about? Perhaps in a question that might yield a different answer, which younger players may have the potential to play someday in Europe?

The Fire's best players are the ones that have a chance to play in Europe someday because this is a very young team. Headlining that category is 22 year-old goaltender Sean Johnson. The 6-4 American has already received a cap for the USMNT and received league-wide accolades for his performance. Johnson is still a bit of a raw product as shown by some early season struggles but the sky is the limit thanks to a mixture of athleticism, quick reflexes and overall size. Marco Pappa is a 23 year-old Guatemalan international that recently played major minutes for his country in the 2011 CONCACAF Gold Cup. Recent rumors have even said Newcastle is interested in having him trial with the team and Pappa himself said he is open to looking elsewhere when his contract runs out after the 2012 MLS season. The Fire recently transferred Gaston Puerari despite some solid production so if someone comes calling in the meantime with the right price, I expect Pappa to move on. Ghanaians Patrick Nyarko and Dominic Oduro are a little old at 25 to have dreams of playing in Europe but I don't think their window is completely sealed especially if we are talking something lower than the top four or five leagues. Nyarko has elite dribbling skills but is being held back by leg strength and poor long-distance shot/pass accuracy. Oduro has the speed to compete in almost any league but finishing had been his problem up until this year. He has made great improvements in that area compiling 5 goals in 19 games this year. Time will tell whether or not he's just enjoying a streak of good form or if he has made actual positive adjustments but this MLS off-season would provide a great opportunity for him to test the market if he's so inclined and available.

I would give honorable mention to Yamith Cuesta and Orr Barouch. Cuesta is a 22 year-old Colombian center back that has a mixture of size, physicality, and confidence to take him far. He's prone to the occasional mental mistake but youth is on his side for now. Barouch is a 19 year-old Israeli international who grew up in the United States. He played in Tigres/UANL youth system and attracted interest from European teams previously. In Barouch's time with the Fire he has looked promising but also had some epic misses hitting the crossbar on a couple of short range shots. Again, youth is on his side but he has some major work ahead of him. There will be some buzz about Chicago's most recent signing Sebastian Grazzini but the Argentine is 30 years old and almost certainly past making an impact for a well-known club abroad especially since he already had a go in some lower European leagues.  His play was solid in Argentina though and the Fire are counting on him creating some magic in the midfield.

3. Are there any particular United players that you, or the readers of your site are excited to see? Is there a buzz in the community for any specific player? Something that I learned during this U.S. tour is that significant portions of the Portuguese and Brazilian communities in the Boston region were quite excited to see the likes of Nani, Anderson, Rafael, and Fabio.

Javier ‘Chicharito' Hernandez. There are an estimated 1 million people that live in the Chicago metro area and claim some sort of Mexican ancestry and that number may be much higher. Chicharito received a large amount of support from the fans last month when Mexico defeated Costa Rica 4-1 at Soldier Field in Gold Cup play. I personally have become a bit of a Chicharito fan because I root for all North American players when the stage is global. Ryan Sealock is one of the authors on the site and follows the EPL much better than I do. He is looking forward to taking a look at Nani even though he generally despises Manchester United. If an attacking mid like Nani was on the Fire, a lot of their problems would go away. Of course bankruptcy might be an issue too trying to balance his salary so we'll happily keep a positive future for the club and just stick with one day of watching Nani, Chicharito, and everyone else on Manchester United come to Chicago.

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Wait a minute...

In the answer to the very first question it says: “Despite having enormous operating profits, the club is hindered in their finances by this debt – and perhaps this puts them into jeopardy for FFP.”

One would think that, given their debt problems, it wouldn’t be prudent to spend like a drunken sailor and try to buy every player on the market. But yet there they are, year after year spending like there is no tomorrow. Their massive debts apparently don’t concern them too greatly.

I have researched FFP a bit, and it sounds like that as long as non compliant clubs can prove they are heading towards compliance, they get extra time to fall under the guidelines. Non compliant teams that aren’t showing improvement can be banned from European competitions all together.

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

Tradition. Honor. Passion.

by Ryan Sealock on Jul 22, 2011 5:03 PM CDT reply actions  

United sold Cristiano Ronaldo for ~£80 million in 2009

They spent in the neighborhood of £20 million last summer and roughly £50 million this summer. They’ve also offloaded a few players here and there millions more. One would think given their complicated debt issues, which is a direct result of a leveraged buyout, they have been quite prudent. Actually, this sounds quite prudent anyway….

Perhaps you have researched the FFP but due to the mysterious nature of the detailed rules of it, and even with those Journos who are most privy to it, this would actually lead me to believe that one couldn’t draw much reasonable conclusion to United’s situation – let alone any other club’s. Too much speculation is involved.

These clubs have too much to lose by failing to comply – we know certain shades of black and white to it all – but most of us aren’t aware of the gray. Let it play out.

Editor and Writer for SB Nation's Manchester United blog, 'The Busby Babe'

http://twitter.com/#!/GeneUmTBB

by Gene Um on Jul 24, 2011 4:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

leniency period

this buys the clubs extra years as well to lower their losses. Current and past buys are spread out over years… it’s a logical guess to use this as reason why this current transfer window is quite more active than in previous years. Again, people are jumping to conclusions far too quick without fully considering the many complicated issues.

Enjoyed the Q’s.

Editor and Writer for SB Nation's Manchester United blog, 'The Busby Babe'

http://twitter.com/#!/GeneUmTBB

by Gene Um on Jul 24, 2011 5:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

Gene thanks for the input...

I did enjoy the Q’s as well. I know a lot of the FFP stuff is still shrouded in gray areas or confusion. I just think the biggest clubs with the biggest debt will have a tougher time complying than those without massive payroll’s. In Manchester United’s defense, they make so much in advertising, merchandise, global branding, etc. So that helps them to have more buying power.

In the end, you are right that waiting to see what happens will be the best approach. I would think Manchester United would still want to be careful this year in the transfer window to make sure they don’t dig the hole even deeper.

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

Tradition. Honor. Passion.

by Ryan Sealock on Jul 24, 2011 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

Orr Barouch Isreali international?

As I recall Orr has yet to commit to a national team side and was under consideration for the US U-20 squad since he qualifies (and does not take up a international slot for the Fire). Has that changed?

by Gregg Mixdorf on Jul 23, 2011 12:17 PM CDT reply actions  

Merwin I believe you are right...

I don’t think anything has changed that I know of. I know he has been in the running for a US U20 spot and holds a green card. And he hasn’t been capped by a senior national team yet. FIFA’s eligibility rules can be confusing, but they changed them in 2009 to allow a bit more freedom for those with dual nationality. Here’s a good link on the changes:

http://yanks-abroad.com/get.php?mode=content&id=4781

Basically, the gist is that if you are dual nationality and represent one country at the youth level, you can apply for a one time exception to change national teams. Even if you get capped by the senior team, as long as it’s a friendly (which doesn’t count for official senior matches), then you can also switch. I believe the age limit used to be 21 years of age, but that has been lifted as well.

So, long story short, he should be open to pick either US or Israel if he is called up to one of the teams.

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

Tradition. Honor. Passion.

by Ryan Sealock on Jul 23, 2011 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Fire have reffered to him as an Isareli international. Perhaps they are wrong but that’s why I said it.

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

by Tweed Thornton on Jul 23, 2011 2:33 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I can't find any international stats for him...

at the very least, I don’t think he has played for the senior Israeli team, so he should still be good to play for the US if he desires and is called upon. He did participate in the U20 Mexican Apertura tournament, so maybe that’s where the Fire get that from? Press wise, it sounds better if you have a player you can call an international for any reason vs. one that you can’t. I think it helps bring an air of legitimacy to said player.

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

Tradition. Honor. Passion.

by Ryan Sealock on Jul 23, 2011 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Barouch is an Israeli citizen. He would have to gain American citizenship before he can play for the U20 Nats, a green card isn’t good enough.

by iron81 on Jul 23, 2011 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

From what I hear...

he is working on his US citizenship right now. Granted, if Israel called him up, then he could accept that. However, at this point, I don’t see a senior team call up from Israel in the very near future. If he gets his US citizenship sooner rather than later, I would tip him to pick the US if given a chance. It says something when Thomas Rongen wants to speak to him about his green card status..

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

Tradition. Honor. Passion.

by Ryan Sealock on Jul 23, 2011 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Cheers

impressive stuff by Chicago… especially Pappa.

Editor and Writer for SB Nation's Manchester United blog, 'The Busby Babe'

http://twitter.com/#!/GeneUmTBB

by Gene Um on Jul 24, 2011 4:54 AM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Yeah I was impressed overall too...

I was hoping for Chicago to play a good, close game, and I think they did that. Obviously Manchester United showed the elite team they are in the 2nd half with great Rooney and Nani goals. I would have liked to see if all of those would have been scored had Sean Johnson stayed in the game.

As for Pappa, there are rumors that Premier League teams may be scouting him. I am a big fan, but there is an undercurrent of Fire fans on various websites calling to get rid of him, whether we have a suitable replacement or not. He has his weaknesses as a player, but he also has great offensive strengths that no one else brings to the Fire.

Hot Time In Old Town SB Nation's blog for Chicago Fire, Soccer, & Chicago History

Tradition. Honor. Passion.

by Ryan Sealock on Jul 24, 2011 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

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Chicago Fire Roster

Goalkeeper

Sean Johnson #25

Jay Nolly #1

Paolo Tornaghi #70 (I)

Defender

Jalil Anibaba #6

Austin Berry #22

Arne Friedrich #23 (I)

Dan Gargan #3

Cory Gibbs #5

Hunter Jumper #99

Steven Kinney #28

Gonzalo Segares #13

Tony Walls #20

Kwame Watson-Siriboe #4

Midfielder

Sebastian Grazzini #10 (I)

Patrick Nyarko #14

Daniel Paladini #11

Marco Pappa #16 (I)

Pavel Pardo #17 (I)

Logan Pause #12

Victor Pineda #27

Rafael Robayo #88 (I)

Michael Videira #21

Forward

Orr Barouch #15

Kheli Dube #7

Kellen Gulley #94

Dominic Oduro #8

Federico Puppo #9 (I)

Chris Rolfe #18

(I) denotes International player per MLS rules. Chicago Fire are currently allowed to sign up to 8 International players.

Players training with the team but not a part of the Chicago Fire roster:

Lucky Mkosana - SuperDraft Selection

Juan David Duque - Has contract with league

Chicago Fire 2012 Transactions

November 29, 2011

- Declined options on Jon Conway, Alec Dufty and Baggio Husidic

December 5, 2011

- Purchased the rights to Orr Barouch from Mexican club Tigres

- Traded first round selection in 2013 Supplemental Draft to Vancouver Whitecaps for Jay Nolly

December 6, 2011

- Re-signed Logan Pause to two-year contract extension

December 7, 2011

- Released Cristian Nazarit and Gabriel Ferrari

December 12, 2011

- Selected Kheli Dube in MLS Re-Entry Draft

January 9, 2012

- Signed Rafael Robayo on a free transfer.

January 11, 2012

- Signed Federico Puppo on a free transfer

January 12, 2012

- Selected Austin Berry with the #9 pick in the SuperDraft

- Selected Lucky Mkosana with the #23 pick in the SuperDraft

- Selected Hunter Jumper with the #28 pick in the SuperDraft

January 15, 2012

- Parted ways with Diego Chaves

January 17, 2012

- Selected Evans Frimpong with the #9 pick in the Supplemental Draft

- Selected Carl Woszczynski with the #15 pick in the Supplemental Draft

- Selected Tony Walls with the #47 pick in the Supplemental Draft

- Selected Justin Chavez with the #66 pick in the Supplemental Draft

January 18, 2012

- Re-signed Pavel Pardo to two-year contract extension

January 23, 2012

- Parted ways with Mike Banner

January 25, 2012

- Signed Kheli Dube

January 30, 2012

- Traded MLS right of first refusal for Wilman Conde to New York Red Bulls in exchange for allocation money

March 6, 2012

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March 7, 2012

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March 8, 2012

- Signed Paolo Tornaghi on a free transfer

March 11, 2012

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March 15, 2012

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April 16, 2012

- Signed Chris Rolfe

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Chicago Fire International Slots

Major League Soccer has 152 slots for international players leaguewide. These slots are split equally among MLS' 19 teams. Teams may trade slots permanently or for short periods of time. Most MLS teams hold onto all 8 slots.

Number of Chicago Fire International spots: 8

1. OPEN

2. Arne Friedrich

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4. Marco Pappa

5. Pavel Pardo

6. Federico Puppo

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The allocation ranking is the mechanism used to determine which MLS club has first priority to acquire a U.S. National Team player who signs with MLS after playing abroad, or a former MLS player who returns to the League after having gone to a club abroad for a transfer fee. The allocation rankings may also be used in the event two or more clubs file a request for the same player on the same day. The allocations will be ranked in reverse order of finish for the 2010 season, taking playoff performance into account.

Once the club uses its allocation ranking to acquire a player, it drops to the bottom of the list. A ranking can be traded, provided that part of the compensation received in return is another club’s ranking. At all times, each club is assigned one ranking. The rankings reset at the end of each MLS League season.

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